The Vene Rule
The following is a guest post by my friend Siouxzen who’s responsible for monopolizing the lion’s (or should I say goat’s) share of my in-game time. I’ve added my own little comments in line [like this] to add a little “clarification” and humour. 
The Vene Rule started out as a joke but slowly became a quick form of communication between healers and tanks in our guild. In the beginning, it was a rule named for resurrection order after a wipe to let the tank know healers were ready. The Main Tank would be rezzed last letting him know everyone else was alive then also buffed last letting him know buffs were done. As we have progressed further into endgame content, the meaning has changed. [unfortunately…]
In the process of moving through trash mobs in an instance, sometimes pulls happen when healers are not ready. [I plead not guilty] By not ready, I mean more than half the healers have less than half their mana. Now, I’m not talking about accidental pulls either. I’m talking about the ones where he just doesn’t want to wait for the pat to return. A quick call out of the Vene Rule means the healers will use their mana to heal the off tank, letting Vene die but not causing a wipe. [this is news to me too :/ ] This buys the healers time to prepare for the next pull with buffs and such, THEN rez Vene and continue.
The key to making this work is making Vene aware of the rule and not abusing it. [like calling it out every other pull?] He hears it said and knows the healers are stressed! [that means I’m winning!] Giving the healers an extra 15 seconds will save a ton of time in the long run. To my knowledge, we have never actually let Vene die on any pull, we haven’t had to.
The Main Tank in any raid has numerous responsibilities [wait… I do?] and an open line of communication between the healers and tanks is very important [so I can make fun of them :D], however, the entire raid doesn’t need to hear a long explanation of what’s going on. Vene hangs out in our healer channel to make him aware of healers comments during the raid. If he has a question on why someone died, generally it’s already been asked by me and answered in the healer channel. The best part of this is our healer channel is named VeneRule! [and here I thought they just worshiped me 
]
Basically, what you want to take away from this guys is the importance of having a strong relationship with your healing team. You can be the best tank in the world, but if you aren’t able to communicate and have a little fun with your healers, you are pretty much doomed. Now let’s just hope my snide remarks in this post don’t get me killed!
Loading …
March 5th, 2008 at 6:47 am
Well I haven’t heard of the Krak rule, but I have heard “We’re not ready!” over vent. Usually I respond with, “There’s just one, geez.” to “Well then you better heal just me!” All as a joke of course. But then again, I do die sometimes. Darn healers wanting full mana bars!
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 7:20 am
When we do Kara, I glance at the raid frames, if atleast 2 healers have 50% or more mana and no one is dead, I’m pulling. Sometimes I even say so over vent
Worst times is when I’m playing my alt shaman and there’s the few moments of just standing around in between pulls. I’m constantly asking the tank “why aren’t we pulling?”. To which he usually responds something like, “Gimme two seconds, jeez!”
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 7:34 am
i have a cool little addon that can make custom bars… i have one for the combined mana of all healers, and if that is more than 50%, i pull… it has worked so far…
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 8:19 am
It depends on how many healers we have, but usually I try and let them get to 2/3 mana before pulling. I like having a little margin for error.
I have the advantage of being married to my main healer. She sits to my left in the room, which is very convenient. If I pull too early and she gets in a bind she usually yells out, “Oh crap… Do a trick, do a trick!”. That’s my signal to hit my pocket watch, use last stand, or whatever to give her a few seconds to get my bacon out of the fire.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 8:42 am
After doing Kara so many times, you get an idea for the flow and what healers can handle. For example, all the trash up to Attumen can be pulled without stopping, only pausing to mark. I let the offtank grab the last mob and move on to start marking so that we can pull right away. Even the odd rogue death doesn’t slow us down.
All casters need to drink right away as soon as they can. Any healer complaints I got were from people unused to speed pulling.
Things tend to slow down in 25 mans when we are doing trash that we haven’t had so much experience with. It is hard to know when everyone is ready and so you end up waiting longer just in case.
For myself, I would’t mind doing the trash missing some buffs so that we can get to the boss faster. Nothing bugs me more than the one person calling out on vent that they are missing buff X when there is only one person in the raid that can cast it. The whole raid has to wait while that person drinks and buffs.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 8:45 am
I don’t stop pulling for much of anything short of a healer death (which really shouldn’t happen often). Learning to move quickly and without pausing makes better raiders.
In Kara I’ve made it the healers responsibility to tell me to stop pulling. I’ve gone so far as to turn off the mana bars so I can’t even see anymore. I died a bit in the begining but they adjusted and I think are better healers for it.
Stepping into ZA and chain pulling is much easier with healers who are using to being on my Kara run. We do tend to bring 3 healers to kara still to gear a new one up though so we have more then we need anymore.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 8:53 am
During Kara, I wait until our healing leader gives me an O.K. to pull mobs bigger than 2 elites. If ther mob has just 2 I mark em up glance for 50% mana then pull. This seems very efficient and works very well in our group.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 8:55 am
http://www.wowace.com/wiki/XRS
Is usually what I use, in addition to raid frames. So long as healer mana is above 50%, and I know the next pull isn’t going to be ridiculous, I’m pulling. One of my priests seems to have a goal of blowing his entire mana bar every trash pull (he’s excellent with mana management in boss fights of course) so I have to make a point of telling him to just sit a pull out and keep drinking every once and a while.
I always try to go pretty far out of my way to help the healers out, and jump pretty hard on anyone trying to irritate them. They’re your most valuable resource, and it’s important that you get along with them well.
Rogues on the other hand…
You really need to find your own personal Valize Venny. If everyone’s trying to get him killed (or chain bopped, so he can’t do anything) no one’s going to make up silly rules about you!
I’m impressed by Sioux’s restraint. She hardly made fun of Venny at all. Are you alright? You didn’t hit your head or anything did you?
This should have been the Feb 31st special addition of tankspot imo!
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 9:04 am
Anglachel, what is that mod called? That sounds like a cool idea.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 9:58 am
for trash, my healers ususally drink in rotations. We have got the pulls down so fast that 2 can take the slack of one that needs a rest. most of my healers though are geared to the point they could solo heal the trash on most everything.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 9:59 am
@ Kavtor
I wrote the article to basically explain the meaning… The “laugh at Vene” post is coming later…Maybe for his birthday =) The Feb. 31st one is good, but the 8g for a shiny fish scale is way better!
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 10:32 am
If I get suckered into running Kara I chain pull until a healer starts yelling or just stops healing in protest. In TK and SSC I generally wait for about 75% mana, since we are relatively new to both instances(2/6 and 2/4).
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 1:04 pm
when i run kara (if i do), i usually pull when healer mana is at 3/4 full. When i start a chain pull, i start the healers off at full and keep going till i see a mana bar almost empty. Being a healer myself on the opposite faction helped as well. I can get a good feel of when to turn down the intensity and give the healers a break.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 1:08 pm
I forgot to mention that when i do a chain pull, i sometimes get a complaint fromt the other tank that we’re pulling too quickly.. So i usually have to tone it down.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 2:11 pm
I agree, it’s definitely important to have a good relationship with your healers. From 5-mans to raids, I always enjoy tanking more when I have a healer I’m good friends with. It applies to everyone you party with really, but the tank-healer bond is something else.
And if it’s all in good fun between friends then fair enough, but when a healer I don’t know lets me die on principle because of an early pull when we really *could* have all lived anyway, it pisses me off to no end. I’ve had a couple of bad experiences with a healer who would let me die if I pulled when he was on 95% mana, I wish I was kidding.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 2:53 pm
Hao, you need to tell that Tank to step up to the plate and play ball then cause no reason another tank should need to slow down only class that needs to sit is Healers imo.
We’ve even gone so far in our ZA/KZ and majority of TK/SSC pulls to do drink rotations for healers and limited dps.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 6:39 pm
steak, i think the reason he wants to tone it down is because he likes to start when the healers are at full mana. However i know that this need not happen every time i pull.. Fortunately i understand a bit about what happens on both ends of the spectrum so i know when to crank it up a notch or two or turn it down.
[Reply]
March 5th, 2008 at 9:08 pm
but but, nobody considers the poor tanks that dont wanna start each pull with 0 rage
For 25 mans, im just an OT, so all i ever hear is “T
[Reply]
March 6th, 2008 at 3:43 am
I’ll chain pull in Kara when possible, unless a healers explicitly tells me otherwise.
For trash mobs in 25-man, I’ll just check using xrs to see if there’s enough healing mana for the fight ahead.
One problem we do have is that one of our tanks is a pally, and he gets kinda pissed when I pull and he has little mana left
– gyre –
[Reply]
March 6th, 2008 at 5:53 am
Hehe, I know what your friend is on about. I’ve been known the very much do the same thing (Considered impatient I guess :P) and if there is a sliver of mana with which to heal me, i’ll be pulling!
[Reply]
March 6th, 2008 at 7:22 am
@ McBash
you just described my situation to a T. (including that my wife sits to my left). It’s funny / scary the similaries
she says “do a clickie!” tho 
I also get a nasty look when i pull too fast tho
that’s MY gauge to slow down.
[Reply]
March 6th, 2008 at 9:35 am
@Hao
With an attitude like that, your OT who wants to slow down will never acheive the glory a Main Tank deserves. It takes someone with some testicular fortitude to push the boundaries and take people to the edge of their abilities.
Ciderhelm goes into a great deal on this on his blog regarding pushing people to their limmits to improve their skills.
You get a finely made sword by heating the steel in a forge and repeatedly pounding out all the impurities. Only after it has undergone this intense process is the blade then ready for use.
[Reply]
March 6th, 2008 at 11:41 am
I usually only take a quick look on the mana bar.
When I hear “wait for mana” I say “Drink faster” and if they argue, I respond “Use a straw” then they smile and adapt.
[Reply]
March 6th, 2008 at 11:55 am
Nice write-up, Siouxzen (and Vene)! This is exactly what I love to read: observations of the “game behind the game.”
While I enjoy reading & to an extent theorycrafting, analyzing observations of players/interactivity in the game are extremely interesting to me.
Thanks for a great read, =)
[Reply]
March 6th, 2008 at 10:46 pm
It depends on what the healer’s comfortable with. Sometimes you just have to pull at 50% mana to keep them on their toes with reaction time. It forces them to be better at managing their mana. Of course this is dependent on how geared your healers are.
I honestly like the number 70%. If it’s below 70 I wait to see if they drink. If not, I pull.
[Reply]
March 7th, 2008 at 10:14 pm
Loved this post! I tend to speed run everything I can, however as I’m fairly new to my guild I’m trying not to look like the “be an ass and pull constantly so everyone dies” guy
In pugs I have people tell me I’m going too fast every run, although worryingly it seems to come from dps who blow their mana on each pull, rather than the healers.
On the flipside of the coin, it’s nice when you do a heroic fast and everyone is happy for such a fast run.
Definitely more fun guest posts by Siouxzen in the future please
[Reply]
March 8th, 2008 at 1:49 am
Thanks for your wonderful comments about my post. It was fun to share a story about Vene and hearing all your stories as well!!
The comment on Tank/Healer bond is one thing that was pointed out that is so true. I’ve always played a priest (my alts are priests) and I think part of it is because I like my warriors!!
[Reply]
March 8th, 2008 at 7:21 am
XRaidStatus ftw!
http://www.curse.com/downloads/details/3582/
[Reply]
March 8th, 2008 at 10:16 pm
I’ve been in a BT farming guild for the last few months and really trash in general is the pacing mechanic of instances and needs to be done fast. The most important thing in the methods that my guild uses is to continuously chain pull after pull. If they are low on mana use a cooldown it’s not like a 3minute cooldown wont be up for a boss >.>
Imo its the healing side of the raids problem if they are oom because they arnt the only mana useing classes in the raid.
Tip for a healer would be: spam your drink button as soon as stuff is killed or hang back and drink and just say so. Buff while on the fly, buffing should not require a 5minute break.
2 day raid weeks are fun and wouldn’t be possible w/o speedy trash clears.
[Reply]
March 9th, 2008 at 8:28 am
Some healers/casters have this misconception that they need full mana before each pull.
What they really need is enough mana for _that_ pull. So depending on the opposition I pull with anything from 10% raid mana to 100%.
[Reply]
March 16th, 2008 at 12:10 pm
@Gorrack
This also shows how far the guild has progressed when they can take chain pulling and quickly move through trash. I totally agree with you. Only problem is, my horde guild really hasn’t gotten that far compared to the ally guild i was in. I really want to push through and maintain a rythym, but they want to take things one at a time. I tried to push thru the trash after entering the back door in kara 2 nights ago (the one mob pulls), but they were still taking drinks at 70% mana (which still baffles me). I know one healer that can do this out of the 3 that we usually take. (i know.. 3 healers are usually a bit much for kara, but this is our progression atm) I kept moving up the stairs while they were still downstairs, they didn’t move up the stairs with me, i got pwned, then the OT couldn’t pick it up and we wiped… i was saddened……
[Reply]
March 17th, 2008 at 6:22 am
I have a leash on me, because my guild knows I have an itchy trigger finger when I pull. I’ll pull carefully and wait till full mana on every pull until they tell me to pull at my preference.
At this point I just begin to spam pull with the statement “I’m not stopping unless someone screams.”
My best friend immediately screams, because she is a butthead.
[Reply]
March 17th, 2008 at 6:52 pm
My main is a resto shaman, and the senior healer in my guild.
I know every healer in our guild personally. Having healed next to them, and knowing exactly how much healing a pull is going to require, has cut our guild kara clear times by over 3 hours over the past couple of weeks.
[Reply]
March 20th, 2008 at 6:45 am
The word I hear most often from my gf who heals me (who also sits beside me) in a run is “PULL!” Or if I’m pulling too slowly, it’s followed by “PULL DAMMIT!”
We’re both speedaholics.
I have pissed off a few people, notably maintanks in Kara, but getting multiple whispers from the raid thanking me for throwing in a little excitement makes up for that.
[Reply]
April 30th, 2008 at 1:50 pm
Oh ya.. @gorrack, the person who told me to slow it down IS officially our main tank…
Lastly, Siouxzen = Susan? Eh.. bored atm…
[Reply]
May 7th, 2008 at 2:24 am
I like to get through Karazhan trash pretty quick, so usually we’ll kill a group/single and move on quickily. I will usually wait for all the healers to have above half though, if they don’t already.
[Reply]
May 26th, 2008 at 10:16 pm
I absolutely love any kind of stairs/edges when having a slow raid/healers. Like the single ghost pulls in KZ. If I feel people are drinking too long, I pull 1 or 2 ghosts, build some quick threat and then jump down to have the mobs run straight through the group while doing some leeroy jankins style talk on vent. Usually wakes everybody up.
[Reply]
June 24th, 2008 at 6:53 am
HM you pull with healers at 50% mana would u ever consider pulling with 50% health? healers can save a ton of mana if they never overheal so should i canel my heal if you above 50%? also all dps can just bandage when they get hit
[Reply]